Natty Life Sucks ft. Fired-up Frank – Part 1

Natty life sucks! It’s one thing to establish a good foundation and work hard on your own the first part of your bodybuilding, but there comes a point when natural just doesn’t cut it anymore and you’re at a serious disadvantage!

Fired-up Frank gives his testimony on where he was natural compared to where he’s gotten since being on TRT and hitting a couple moderate dosed cycles. We are talking beginner type gains at 54 years of age, roughly 36 lbs in just over a year!

This podcast is part 1 of a 2-3 part series on the differences between natty versus enhanced and why we both prefer being on hormones.

Click the play button below to listen to Natty Life Sucks ft. Fired-up Frank – Part 1

Prefer to read? You’ll find a transcript of the podcast below!

(Podcast transcript is abridged for easier reading. JD = John Doe, FF = Fired-up Frank)

JD: What’s up, everybody? Thanks for joining me for another JDB podcast. I’ve got Frank on the podcast again and we were shooting the shit the other night, back and forth, A, about his progress so far. You’re trying to build right now, right?

FF: For 14 months I’ve been bulking, man. It’s funny. I knew we were going to do the podcast so I got on scale today and was 229.6.

JD: Get the fuck out of here.

FF: I’m probably retaining some fluid, but yeah, 229.6.

JD: You’re catching up to me, man.

FF: Last time we did the podcast, I was at…

JD: 224

FF: Was I at 224? I thought I was maybe 215, 216.

JD: Maybe. You might have been 220.

FF: Maybe. I don’t know.

JD: I’d have to go back and listen to it.

FF: But I mean, since I signed up with you, it’s been 14 months. I signed up with you September of 2021, right? So that’s like 14 months. I started like, what, I think I was like 193, 194.

JD:Yeah, you weren’t eating enough.

FF: But I’m all natural, by the way.

JD: Yeah, all natural. Ha. My next point, point B is what this podcast is going to be about. But before we get into natural versus unnatural, you haven’t really ran a lot of shit.

FF: No.

JD: I mean, you’ve ran some gear.

FF: Yeah.

JD: But you haven’t taken crazy dosages.

JD: You just kept your diet consistent. You’ve been training hard.

FF: Force feeding myself.

JD: Absolutely.

FF: I mean, listen, I get the big three, right? It’s training, hormones and diet and all three have to be on point. But with me, it’s always been the food that’s always been a weak link in the chain. It’s like, you know what, I’m up at 1:30 in the morning and I’m cooking a pound of ground turkey with rice and I’m eating late. Just getting that food in, man. That’s like really the thing.

JD: You know what’s been happening to me lately, this daylight savings time has just really fucked me up because I go to bed earlier and I shit you not, man, I’ll get up at one in the morning thinking it’s probably like six, and I’m like, dude, I’m hungry. I’m not really trying to gain any more size.

FF: I don’t think you need it.

JD: Well, yeah, I actually look bigger when I lose weight at the point that I’m at.


JD: But I’ll try to go for something that doesn’t really have a lot of carbs and isn’t just going to sit in me too bad. So a lot of times it might be a shake or something, just something that doesn’t have a lot of carbohydrates in it in the middle of the night. You know me, man. I’m a proponent of carbohydrates, but just not in the middle of the night when your goal is not to gain any more weight. But did you eat a lot yesterday on Thanksgiving?

FF: No, actually, I probably ate less than I should have. I’m not a big Thanksgiving meal guy, and for reasons I don’t want to get into, I usually cook and we decided to get the whole thing catered. It was okay, you know what I mean? It wasn’t bad, but it’s not my cooking. You know what I mean?

JD: Yeah. I ate a little more than I wanted. I went to my parents house and at first I wasn’t going to do any of it and then my wife ended up going to her family’s and I went to my parents’. They wanted to see me, my other two brothers live in different parts of the country. I just felt terrible if I didn’t go over there. So I ate. But I got on the scale this morning just to see what the damage was. I was like, man, bad fluid weight man. 239. So I went to the gym. Of course I had crazy strength from all the carbs. I took a picture of one of my forearms and sent it to a couple of people. I was like, “Dude, look at this shit.”

FF: Vascularity.

JD: Oh, my God. Garden hoses. But now my 40 minutes on the StairMaster, and I felt really good. When you don’t do that all the time, when you eat like that, you just feel incredible. But that day you’re strong and everything, and I just think it’s being able to turn the light switch off that makes the difference between whether you have those days where everything’s swollen vascular or you turn into a fat ass. It’s funny because you were messaging me the other night and somehow we got into talking about natural versus unnatural and how ridiculous you thought it was that some people are taking something in an amount that is definitely not natural. I mean, fuck, testosterone is natural, right?

FF: Sure it is. Yeah. You brought up a good point. Because the thing with me, with natty guys… Well, first of all, what happens is I go down a rabbit hole and I end up on these Facebook news groups, and I always get stuff, and it’s usually like the supplement companies and you get all the comments and everything. And most of the supplements are like testosterone boosters. You know, it’s like testo greens. Apparently there’s like some miracle ingredient in spinach that’s going to boost your testosterone. Here’s the black hole. Unfortunately, with this health and fitness industry. You get a guy who’s a spokesperson who is clearly not natural. But the thing is, he can’t tell the truth because he’s pushing a product that is supposed to naturally boost testosterone, right? When we know the best way to boost testosterone is go on fucking test. You know what I mean? And there’s just such a broad gray area with what people consider natural and what people don’t consider natural. You brought up a good point. You were talking about creatine. Well, if you’re like doing 5 grams of creatine a day, the body naturally gets creatine from diet, but not at those levels. So are you natural? You do have unnatural levels of creatine in your system.

JD: Right. And then I tell people all the time, we haven’t been natural since we got off the tit when we were babies, man.

FF: No. Not at all.

JD: I mean. is Similac natural? The baby formula. So this whole natural versus unnatural thing, these people, they’re taking some kind of moral high ground with it….

FF: That’s the issue with that. For guys it’s like bragging rights. You’re taking this moral high ground where morals are not applicable to the situation because you’re making a personal choice. Now, my case, this is a big part of the reason why I gravitated toward signing up with you is because I bought one of your books a couple of years ago, and I was in my happy place for a long time, around 190 pounds. And I was like, you know what man, I want to get bigger. So let me reach out to this guy. I didn’t know you from Adam other than your book. And we developed this relationship and here I am. I went from 193 to pushing 230 pounds now.

JD: Are you happier with your new size or at 193?

FF: No, I don’t like me at 193.

JD: Isn’t it funny?

FF: That’s the thing. This is a really funny thing, too, because I’m 54 years old and if we’re being honest about things, I’ve really got no business doing this at my age. You know what I’m saying? But you know what? I’m a glutton for punishment, I guess. It’s something I always wanted to do and it’s funny… Even my wife, this is what I laugh at, My wife, she’s always been into the guys that have the underwear model bodies and stuff like that and she liked me at 190 pounds. But you the other day, I’m like, “Be honest with me. Do you like me better at 225.” And she’s like, Yeah. Fuck yeah.”

JD: Isn’t it funny? I love these guys that are like, “I don’t be your size or anything.” Man, shut the fuck up. Yeah you do. Haha.

FF: You know what? Listen, there’s a certain amount of truth… Okay, So Ronnie Coleman, when he won his last Mr. Olympia, he was like, 300. Now, I don’t want to be 300 pounds. So I can turn around and legitimately say I don’t need to be as big as Ronnie Coleman. But for the most part, if you got a guy who’s sitting around 150 pounds of lean mass and he’s all like, “Well, I don’t need to look like you.” It’s like, no bro. You don’t want to put in work. You want to look like me.

JD: But as far as I’m concerned, between 200 and 250 pounds, it’s just a very well developed, tasteful look to me. Size kind of is all relative. I remember being in high school, seeing a kid wearing a medium sized T shirt who might have been a buck 80. We thought he was huge.

FF: Oh, yeah. In high school. Yes. You didn’t realize like how skinny guys were until you get bigger. But I mean, the thing is, a lot of that weight thing too. It’s also height relative. I mean, if you 5’7” and you’re 200, you’re going to look way bigger than if you’re like 5’11” and 200.

JD: It’s just so funny though, the people who have never had a taste of it. “I don’t want that. No, I don’t want that.” It’s like, you know what, I’ve had a taste of both. Trust me. Fuck yeah, you do.

FF: Yeah, without a doubt.

JD: Not to cut you off here, but I’m going to make this point before I forget. I’m trying to say this as humbly as I can, but it is such a compliment when you go places, and I live in a big city and you do too, but when you go places and like, I had this one guy, I met the guy one time before on the way to a motocross park with my son. We were getting something to eat and he remembered me. We were talking about handguns. I had like a Smith and Wesson shirt on. And I go to this car wash. I met this guy out of town, wasn’t even here. I go to this car wash to drive my wife’s SUV through the automatic wash and he’s like, “Wait. I know you. We had a conversation before. Yeah, we were talking about handguns and this and that…” and I’m like, oh my God, dude, how the fuck do you remember me? That two years ago. He said, “Yeah, you were that big motherfucker.” That’s how they remember you.

FF: Without a doubt. Without a doubt.

JD: It’s like your presence made such an impression that they remember. And it’s like I said, I’m trying to sound humble about it, but it’s a nice compliment that your presence can leave that impression on people. And that’s something that you did through your own efforts and it’s fucking badass. I think anabolics help with that.

FF: I noticed, like I said, the reception that I get at the gym, living the life of 225. People go out of the way and they nod, they smile, they say hello. I don’t know. It’s almost like they’re paying tribute. And don’t get me wrong, I’m not the biggest guy in the gym, but I wear a stringer tank top and I look pretty jacked. And people acknowledge it. And the best part of it is you got that little core group of guys that you’re friends with.

JD: It’s a respect thing. I think that when you get to that point where you become a man’s man. The real motherfuckers acknowledge it. The bitches are never going to acknowledge it. But I don’t want to hang out with them anyway, right? So it’s kind of this mutual respect thing. Like, hey, we both come from the same place. We’re cool. Everybody says the bigger guys in the gym are the dicks. I always found it the opposite, man.

FF: No. Not at all. Because they’ve got nothing to prove, right?

JD: Exactly.

FF: It’s funny. I got a core group of guys. Nick, I’ve told you about. He’s got the widest back I’ve ever seen. Just genetically, man. His back is ridiculous. So he’s like, 5’9”. He’s 218. He doesn’t really make a big deal about my size. He makes a big deal of how good I look. He’s like, I can’t believe you’re 54. So he’s all like, I can’t believe you look the way you do and everything at your age. And I got my two other friends. I got Jay in Melbourne. And they’re like, Bro, you look swole. And they’re all like, man, I’m trying to look like you. I want to get big like you. It’s a damn good feeling. I used to get my fair amount of, I guess, acknowledgement even at 190 pounds but it’s a totally different look.

JD: You’re actually up 36 fucking pounds in 14 months and that’s what shocks me is at your age, those are like some beginner gains. That’s like first year fucking gains.

FF: I mean, shit, again, going back to what this is about. Natural sucks, right? That’s what the thing is. See, with me, I don’t have an ulterior motive. I’m not out there pushing supplements. I’m not out there pushing products and stuff. I feel like I think the reason why I could gravitate towards you and your program is because you want to know what you and I have in common; We’re purveyors of truth and there’s not a lot of honesty in this business. And the thing I’m saying is, I tell people, I get clients, I get people that sign up with me and they want to know what I do. And if I’m going to put somebody on a program and tell them how to lift, and I’m going to tell them how to eat, how disingenuous would it be if I get a 45 year old guy sign up with me? And I’m like, dude, go get your hormones checked. Because, look, if the hormones are not where they need to be, it’s the weakest link in the chain. And that’s the thing that pisses me off about this industry. This whole idea that guys got this idea that they want to convince you that they got this unnatural look being natural. And I’m not playing that game. It’s like, you know what? If you’re going to put your money down, you’re going to sign up with me. I’m telling you the fucking truth. And it’s like, I’m an older guy. I could not have done this without fucking hormones.

JD: I tell everybody from the start, I do the same thing that you do. We go over the hormones. Have you had your labs done? Because, look, I’m going to be real with you. You’re pissing in the wind if you have testosterone levels that are in the dirt. That motivation to get off your ass and go to the gym is not the same.

FF: Because you’re not making progress.

JD: No. Because the chemicals in your head aren’t positive enough that’s for you to go over the edge. It’s not going to fucking happen. So you’re going to go for a few weeks, you’re going to be absolutely miserable because you’re not going to reap the same benefits, and you’re going to think you’re wasting your time. That feelgood effect is never going to quite come the same way that it comes to somebody that restores their own hormone levels or their natural hormones.

FF: I’ve been there because the thing with me was that I was not a stranger to the gym, but I was, like, 47 years old, and my work ethic at the gym was good. Now, did I really know how to train? That’s the thing that’s funny about bodybuilding, too. It’s like, just when you think you’ve got it figured out, you go to the gym one day and you’re like, man, I really didn’t know what the fuck I was doing. There’s different levels of hypertrophy development. Bodybuilding is a very nuanced sport. I think people don’t really understand the subtleties and the nuances involved with building the physique, but that’s besides the point. The thing is, I’m 47 years old. My work ethic was good. I mean, it was good enough and I think I knew enough about lifting in order to grow. I always made sure I got enough protein. I was always a big protein guy trying to build and stuff. I was still, like, 180, 185 pounds. I wasn’t really going anywhere. And then I got my hormones checked and bro, my test was in the toilet. I was at 350. And it’s just like, you know what, man? I went on test with the doctor. I went back ten weeks later, I put on 14 pounds of lean mass without even really changing my diet that much. And then I went back at 26 weeks and I’d put on another 6 pounds. Because that’s the thing, too. Everybody thinks, well, if you’re on drugs, you just take drugs and you just grow for the rest of your life. People don’t even understand. Even when you’re on hormones, there’s a hard plateau. So you figure it out. I got 14 pounds after ten weeks, and then, like, the next 16 weeks, I only netted another 6 pounds. Okay? But still, in six months, I put on 20 pounds of leam mass just being on TRT. And then after that I hit the wall. You hit that hard plateau. That first 20 was way easier than the next ten.

JD: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Going back to when people first hear about this stuff, I always get one of two types of people. I get the people that I tell them about this stuff and they appreciate the honesty and they take the advice, and then they go get help, and then they get on testosterone, and like a year later, the guy’s like, “Dude, thank you so much. My fucking life is fantastic.” Or I get that guy that’s like, “He’s telling me to use steroids. That’s not me. I don’t want to be a junkie.” Right?

FF: Yeah. You know, The thing that’s fucked up with people is unfortunately, look, I’m kind of Darwinian about things. I’m all about natural selection, right? So an average person has an IQ of about 100. I’m trying to be humble here, but my IQ is probably about 130.

JD: Serial killer level.

FF: Yeah. So say you’re in that high IQ thing, too. My wife is very intelligent. So you’ve got to look at it like, if the average IQ is 100, think about how many people are living between 85 or 90 to 100. It’s like 34% of the population. Okay? So certain people just don’t grasp basic concepts. And what I think happens is people are very susceptible and they’re very impressionable. So steroids have just been demonized. I don’t even like to call them steroids. I like to call them hormones because that’s what the fuck they are. They’ve been demonized for so long that people can’t step outside of that mindset in order to get a more realistic picture of what hormones actually are. If you look at it this way, if you’re low on testosterone, your body is basically telling you, naturally, I’m not making enough testosterone. Now, my wife has got a sluggish thyroid. So she’s on thyroid medication. She’s going to be on thyroid medication for the rest of her life. So she takes Levothyroxine. Why is it that it’s okay to take thyroid meds if you have a sluggish hormone, but it’s not okay to take testosterone if your testosterone production is sluggish?

JD: Masculinity is bad. Haha.

FF: It’s just a stigma. That’s all it is. And I’ll tell you what I mean, I don’t want to go up on a tangent about it because I know you’re not a sports guy, but I blame Major League Baseball and all that shit 20 years ago with all the freaking guys doing steroids. You got grown men that just have no fucking concept of reality.

JD: Yeah, I saw it somewhere. It was like a picture of Babe Ruth and it said that Babe did it on hot dogs and beer. I don’t know what his record was compared to Mark McGuire, but I’m sure if you put the two together, Mark McGwire would have probably beat his record, right?

FF: Well, it’s funny, Mark McGwire actually holds the all time historical record for most home runs per at bat. He had like one home run for every eleven at bats, which is ridiculous.

JD: I was looking for a Mark McGwire jersey, a baseball jersey. I wanted to fucking rock the McGwire jersey. Couldn’t find one. You have to have it custom made. Even a lot of the sites, like, was is it DHgate that sell the knockoff type shit, but it’s pretty on par with the quality of the Major League Baseball jerseys. I couldn’t even find one there.

FF: All those guys from 20 years ago, like Bonds and Clemens and McGwire, Manny Ramirez, Alex Rodriguez, they all got demonized. And the reason why they got demonized is because everybody was on fucking drugs. It’s just that they were still the best players. So it’s like, we’re just going to pick on the guys that set all the records and were the best players, but there were mediocre players that were on drugs, too. Like I said, people unfortunately have such an unrealistic picture about what hormones are, what they do, and what their purpose is. Because the whole idea of a guy who was going to brag about being natural, it’s like, dude, are they giving out trophies to natty guys? Is there some guy going around handing out cookies or handing out fucking trophies for being natural? To me, the thing is, what’s the upside? What’s the payoff? What’s the end game of being natural?

JD: Well, that’s the funny thing too, because if you ask some of them, the end game is a longer lifespan. But here’s the thing. I have real life examples. I have friends that are older than me. One of them is approaching 70. He grew up in Venice Beach. I mean, he’s legitimately like a golden era bodybuilder, right? And he does have health problems. His kidneys are in really bad shape, but he has had chronic blood pressure issues his entire life. And there was a period of time where he probably could have gotten it under control and he didn’t and that’s the reason his kidneys are in the shape they’re in. So let’s take somebody with blood pressure issues who wants to run Deca. That’s a terrible choice for someone with blood pressure issues. The worst gear you could run…

FF: I can’t touch Deca. My blood pressure goes through the roof, I won’t even touch it.

JD: Some guys, they can’t even do a c a week of Deca because it throws them through the roof. If they knew that and they are getting their labs done and they’re giving a shit about checking their blood pressure and they’re listening to what their body is telling them, then no. It’s awfully hard to put the finger on steroids and say, well, that’s the reason he died at 71 years old instead of 85.

FF: It’s impossible. Because the thing is the bodybuilding lifestyle… People don’t understand. People paint everything, with a broad brush. So they go, oh, he’s on steroids or he’s not. Well, there’s different amounts. If you take a guy like myself, right? If I do HRT and I’m on testosterone, and just for the sake of transparency, probably about 35 weeks ago, I started working in what they consider… I don’t know if you’d consider it a micro dose or whatever, but a very small amount of growth hormone. So I’m on growth, and I’m doing 2 IUs a day. There’s bodybuilders out there that are doing 10 IUs a day. 12 IUs a day. What a doctor or one of those longevity clinics would refer to 2 IUs a day. Right? They call it like an anti aging dose or like a medicinal dose or whatever the case may be. There’s a big difference between having your test levels and your growth levels being on what’s considered the high end of normal, as opposed to a bodybuilder who is on seven different compounds. And like I said, it’s not even the same game. I mean, you do know when guys are getting ready for contests, they’re stacking three compounds. They’re doing insulin, clenbutyrol, thyroid hormone. The other thing people don’t really understand. You know this better than me, right? How unhealthy is just the diuretics?

JD: That’s the worst part of the equation. That’s the worst part.

FF: Trying to get peeled.

JD: A lot of these guys that are dropping like flies… “Oh, we don’t get it. He went to the pre-judging and…” Their organs are shutting down, dude. They’re dehydrated. It’s gone so far on the judging of conditioning versus everything else. And another thing, too, is growth holds water. And it’s very evident with the facial structures of some of these guys as they diet down. Their face does not look like somebody that’s normally dieting down. They still have a lot of fluid in their face, a very wide face. And then at the last minute, what they do is they go overkill on diuretics to get rid of fluid that maybe should have taken off earlier, but they didn’t want to sacrifice the size. So they err on the side of just overkill with diuretics. So I think modern bodybuilding, as far as the competitive scene, when you start getting top amateur professional level, yeah. Hell yeah. It’s unhealthy.

FF: Yes. But that’s kind of what I was getting at. The whole idea behind being natural is this idea that you’re going to live longer. But if I’m on the high end of normal on my test and my testosterone level is say between 900 and 1100, my testosterone levels aren’t like 3000, 2000. They’re on what they consider the high end of normal. Right. The other thing that people don’t really take into consideration is there is a direct correlation between muscle mass, bone density, physical strength, and longevity. It’s a fucking fact. You can go look this shit up yourself. People that lift weights, maintain muscle mass, maintain bone density, and work out, live longer than people that don’t.

JD: Well, yeah. Most old people, when they get ready to die, they stop eating.

FF: They stop eating. Yeah.

JD: But the thing is, I’m going to touch on the growth for a little bit here. I’ve heard a lot of guys say, “oh, anything less than eight or ten units a day is a waste.” That is absolute nonsense, because I’m not a proponent of high amounts of GH. I think two or three units a day, if it’s legit growth hormone, two or three IUs a day can make a world of fucking difference once you’re on it long enough. And what it’s done for me, I’m not on it right now. I’m taking a break. But it makes your gear more effective. It makes your recovery insane.

FF: Yes. Yeah, I don’t mean to interrupt you but the thing is, you know what my deal was, right? I’ve got a broken back. I’ve got a pars fracture, which I’ve had probably most of my adult life. So basically, I don’t even have a disc anymore between my L5 and my S1. I’ve been grinding bone on bone for years, okay? So I used to take Meloxicam, ten milligrams a day just to not be in pain. I had this ridiculous forearm injury that was nagging the shit out of me. I was at a point where I couldn’t do pull ups. I couldn’t even do bicep work because my right forearm was destroyed. I mean, all through covid, working out in my garage and it nagged me for years. And then you remember I had the issue with the shoulder. We thought maybe I had a partially torn labrum in my right shoulder. So that’s the thing. I’m 54 years old. I’m a fucking gym rat. And you know what? The injuries are starting to pile up.

JD: How’s the shoulder doing now, by the way?

FF: I have to nurse it at times, and I have to listen to my body, and sometimes I piss it off. And I may have to maybe not do this exercise and maybe do something different, but try to fuck around with my elbow position, do tables, whatever it is that I’ve got to do to try to not piss it off. But the point being is that after being on GH for 30 weeks, I have never been this injury free in my life. I’m off the pain meds. I don’t even have to take the Meloxicam. My back has never felt better. My forearm injury is completely healed. I have no issues with the forearm. And, you know, the shoulder is, I’d say, at 95% of what it was. It’s not 100%. I’ve got to train smart, and I’ve got to train around that shoulder thing. But the growth hormone has been like a lifesaver for me.

JD: Yeah, I think that was the biggest thing I noticed about it is the improved sleep. I noticed that pretty quick when I got on it. And I started having all kinds of crazy dreams again like you do when you’re like a kid, like going to puberty like a teenager. Some fucking weird dreams. Some of them were actually fun. I was pissed that I had to wake up. I was like, damn it, man. That was really cool. But then the real cosmetic effects come three or four months down the road into it. And I think the reason for that, and I may not be 100% on this, but I read something about your exposure time to it is very limited. The way the body naturally produces growth is it does it in pulses and when you take it exogeneously, it’s not a lot of exposure time to it. It hits the liver, gets synthesized to IGF-1, and the whole process is done in like 20 or 30 minutes. So if you take that short window, you have to multiply that by an awful lot to get a lot of exposure time to it. And the longer you’re on it, the more exposure time you’ve had to it and then obviously that’s when you see the results.

FF: It took me about 30 weeks to really feel healthy. I was on it for about 30 weeks.

JD: The biggest thing is the insulin resistance. That’s why I tell a lot of guys, look, everybody’s different. Some guys can run two or three IUs forever and never have an issue. Other guys, once they get to four to six, they’ll start having an issue. So what I suggest to a lot of guys is what I’m doing with myself, once you’re on it for, obviously you want to be on a five or six months the first time you get on. You don’t want a break. However, I like the five day on, two day off pattern.

FF: Which is what I do.

JD: Right. And the reason for that is to help prevent that insulin resistance because you get two days without it, where your body can kind of say, okay, you know, we’re going to function normally. But after that initial priming period, that first five or six months, I suggest people take a 30 day break and then resume. And it does two things, it makes you more sensitive to it so a little bit goes further and then also it can help prevent that insulin resistance. But it’s not like starting over. With a 30 day break, it’s not like, oh, you’ve got to do it for another five or six months. And then I say after that first five or six months you’re on it, you take that 30 day break after every twelve weeks of running. I go by how many kits somebody’s used a month. No, I’m sorry. Four units a day, five days on is going to get you about a month out of a kit. So if they tell me, hey, I’m doing two I know it’s ten weeks for two units a day. If it’s four units, it’s basically a month for every four units. So I just do the math on my head and say, Look, man, you’ve got to break for 30 days. I want you to prick your damn finger in the morning, check your blood glucose levels. Because here’s the thing. The health is important. I think if you know what you’re doing and you stay healthy, then the results are only going to get better.

FF: Right.

JD: But what happens is some guys get so deep into the shit that things can start slipping that they could have prevented, but because they don’t want to get the lab work, or they just think, oh, it can’t happen to me. Yeah, shit can freaking happen.

FF: Anything can happen. I think the great thing about being on HRT for me is it makes you more cognizant of your health. Because I get lab work done every six months religiously. This is the problem that I have with people, they don’t understand hormones because they paint everything with a broad brush. There’s no such thing as safe and effective. I don’t give a shit if it’s testosterone or if it’s fucking vitamin C.

JD: The more effective it is, the more side effects there are.

FF: The thing I’m saying, everything is risk to benefit ratios. So the thing is, are you on hormones? Yeah. You know what? There are risks associated with it. So you’ve got to donate blood, right? Which is good to keep your red blood cell count low. You’ve got to get your lab work done. You’ve got to make sure your liver, your kidneys, your prostate and all that stuff, you’ve got to make sure your shit is healthy. You know what I mean? But the thing that’s funny about it is I know people that literally never go for labs. They don’t go to doctors. They just roll the dice with their health. I’m the exact opposite, and I’m on hormones. That, I think, makes me more cognizant, because, you know, if you’re on hormones, you have to stay on top of things unlike somebody who’s like, “oh, I’m a natural. I’m a natty guy.” or whatever the case may be. I’m scheduled to go for my next colonoscopy. I’ve got to go 13 December, all right? I got a notification. Even with that, I had a friend who died at 41 years old from colon cancer.

JD: Yeah, I’m just getting mine done, too.

FF: Yeah, because, I mean, the thing about it is that, you know what? Once you start showing signs of having it, it’s usually too late. And I think being in this sport and being in this industry and being on certain things make you more cognizant of the fact you have the side effects, the raw potential, the deleterious health effects. I have to stay on top of things more.

JD: I’ve got a friend going through that right now. He has a growth near his prostate or some sort of cancer. He’s been going through radiation. They’re trying to shrink it in hopes that they go in and remove it. If it hasn’t shrunk enough, he’s going to be on a colostomy bag the rest of his life.

FF: Yeah, that’s what I’m saying. It’s just, you know, people unfortunately don’t do preventive anything in this country. Like, nothing is preventative. Everything is we wait for something to break before we fix it.

JD: Right.

FF: Unfortunately, that’s how we roll. I think about, like, how many people they end up having serious health problems or they end up actually dying because they’re not on top of their health.

JD: Something else. I’m going to get off topic off that topic for a minute. And I want to bring this up because you mentioned something the other day. You said, this really pissed me off the more I thought about it, this belief that there’s like a higher grade of natural, right? Like we can super supplement to the point where we’re still natural, but we can look unnatural. And that’s really what the fitness industry is trying to sell now is this idea that there are certain supplements that, “yeah, you’re not necessarily a juice head, but you can kind of look like them.” I think it’s kind of bullshit. What do you think about that?

FF: Like I said earlier, you know, the problem with the way the industry is they get a guy who’s obviously not a natural guy to be the spokesperson for a supplement, to try to sell this illusion that if you take this supplement, this testosterone booster, for example, or this pre-workout, you’re going to look like Jay Cutler. It doesn’t work like that. And the thing I find funny about the hypocrisy and the level of ignorance of people, like, I swear to God, bro, I saw something pop up on my Facebook feed. It was about Frank Zane. And the whole title of the article was “Was Frank Zane Natural”.

JD: Fuck no!

FF: Of course he wasn’t fucking natural. What are you kidding? Wasn’t his nickname like The Chemist or something like that?

JD: Yeah, well, he was a chemistry teacher, so I don’t know if it was because he was teacher or obviously he probably had a lot of knowledge about it. He wasn’t a bigger guy because of his fucking genetics.

FF: Right.

JD: If he could have been the size of Arnold Schwarzenegger, he would have been. I hate hearing that. Guys are like, “Oh, well, he decided that he wanted a more aesthetically pleasing body.” No, he just couldn’t fucking get any bigger.

FF: He just couldn’t get that way.

JD: Right. Get the fuck out of here with that.

FF: Again, this is going back to the whole thing with like, I love to troll baseball pages on Facebook with all the idiots, right? The thing that is funny about what people’s perceptions are. They look at a guy who’s like a baseball player and they go, “oh, he was a really big guy. He was on steroids.” And for a smaller guy. “Oh, no, he wasn’t on steroids.” Because well, because you’re trying to evaluate whether a guy was on drugs based upon his appearance. And they never factor in genetics into the equation. Some guys are just naturally bigger and some guys respond better to gear than other guys.

JD: Hey, we’re going to end it right there. We’re going to do a part two of this. Stay tuned.

Straight from the Underground ebook


6 thoughts on “Natty Life Sucks ft. Fired-up Frank – Part 1”

    • dont worry, part 2 is coming! Damn Zoom recordings require an upgrade to go over 40 minutes now, but I upgraded don’t worry! Thanks for listening! -JD

  1. I love your podcast. I am 50 and typically stay under a gram total and learned alot from you and will probably compete next summer. I have competed twice and struggle the last week either being too depleted or spilling over. I would like to get it right one time and be done with the stage. 2 years ago I stepped on stage at 228 at 6 foot 2. What training package do you recommend?

    • Probably the gold plan which is 12 wks long, but it depends on how far out condition you are. I try to have people ready to go a couple weeks ahead of time, that way all you’re doing is holding out waiting to kill shit! Feel free to send an email inquiry and we can discuss a plan of action brother. Thanks for listening/following! -JD


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